garry
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Post by garry on Apr 19, 2005 15:06:00 GMT
Hi. I have a car with what I believe to be a Peugeot Diesel TUD PSA engine.
Do any turbo manifolds exist for this car? ..... will the turbo manifolds from the larger 1.9 XUD? unit fit the 1.5 TUD head.....
thanks.
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Post by 504gld on Apr 19, 2005 22:54:27 GMT
Hello Gary,
Peugeot Citroen never made a turbo diesel version of this engine. The increase in size from 1360 to 1527, and a switch from all alloy to iron block, alloy head would of had us thinking this was on the books. I guess HDi started to steel the development time.
Lada Niva/Samara on the continent use the TUD Diesel, and its also found in Indian built versions of the Hyundai Accent called MARUTI ESTEEM. Closer to home, Rover Metro and 115 had TUDs. Continential Nissan Micras sported it too!
Is this engine in a 106 or AX? Are you going to have room to get the turbo in? Also consider the fuel pump will need considerable adjustment, and the fuel injectors may need to be changed. Normally on XUD the pump and injectors and not interchangable with Atmo's.
Try phoning Turbotechnics on 01604 705050, I think I recall some artical on an AX that was turbo charged that they did.
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garry
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Post by garry on Apr 19, 2005 23:17:48 GMT
Thanks a lot for the reply. I am struggling to find any info about this engine on the net. Any info or links that will help me to tune this engine (turbo or not) are appeciated. I was given a car. I stress that I would never have accepted it had in not been for the fact it was fitted with a Peugeot Diesel. The car is a Rover 115 Metro  I own and have owned throughout the years SAAB Turbo's so I know Turbocharging well. The only thing stopping me from adding a Turbo to the Tud are turbo manifolds..... Im not going to go to the effort and expence of fabricating custom manifords however..... Had manifolds existed that I could have salvaged from a scrap yard then I would have had a go. I guess as the Tud engine is I believe indirect injection then increasing the pressure should not affect the spray pattern too much. However if a low pressure turbocharging direction is adopted then fuel pressure or even the lack of an intercooler is within feasable reach without major modification. Boost controller I would use would be the APC SAAB system which operates independant of ANY engine management system be it electronic, mechanical or chips.... Turbo would be set @ a high boost rise curve to a low Max boost just enough to help get things moveing. However..... Its looking increasingly like a Tud to Turbo conversion would fall at the first hurdle....manifolds. I have started to tweak the engine a bit by raising the rev limit slightly....... Next step will be to see if the injectors benefit from a clean.... unfortunatly the airfilter looks very new so I dont realisticaly think I can get her breathing any better. Any other cost free tweaks I can make? ....or even low cost (excluding useless cone filter mods or large backpressure bruising BHP reducing exhausts) |
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Post by 504gld on Apr 21, 2005 17:30:27 GMT
Well I am assuming you are looking for accelleration performance rather than top speed? Tradionally the Rover Metro/114D had much lower gearing than the 106/AX, which meant it was quicker in accelleration, but couldn't make 90mph. I don't know if the Rover gearing remained lower on 115D.
Raising the revs isn't necessarily going to give you more performance on a diesel, as the torque curve will have well dropped off by the time the 4500-5000 rpm speeds are hit. You will only burn more fuel, and risk the head gasket. Upping the fueling will just give black smoke, as there isn't enough air to burn it without the turbo pushing more in. I'm afriad your 115 isn't going to go much faster.
The 106D benefited from its handling, despite lack of power could be driven foot to the floor in 3rd around the trickest roads tyres singing, on the tail of a beemer!
There really isn't too much information on the TUD motor on the net, just fragments. Its still in production just like all Peugeot diesel engines, in India but no longer in any British market vehicles.
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garry
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Post by garry on May 4, 2005 20:02:48 GMT
yup....
I have yet to clean the injectors.... That may help I guess although its only done 70K
supercharging?
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Post by 504gld on May 4, 2005 21:48:42 GMT
Well an italian decoke is worth a go! Just drive in 3rd slowly raising the revs right until you feel the pump govener kick in and the engine pulling back on the fuel, lift off, then back on full a few times, until any black smoke clears up. Can't vouch for your engine's life, but maybe worth a go. If you want them overhalled, its about £20 per injector plus vat at Lucas centres.
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garry
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Post by garry on May 5, 2005 15:14:21 GMT
"until you feel the pump govener kick in and the engine pulling back on the fuel"
Ohh... sounds interesting, how do I stop it pulling back on the fuel !!!!!
secondly, I just found out that some peugeot petrol engines with a similar looking intake to the TUD item have reduction in the inlet piping filtration system, is there any chance that the intake is somehow using a restrictor in the inlet tubing to reduce the diameter, like a choke, to deliberatly detune the engine output.? as in some of the Petrol Peugeots.
It would seem feasable that a small diesel car will be purchased because of its economy thus limiting the amount of diesel it is capable of burning would be an option to the manufacturer especially if a unit such as the TUD is universal...ie fitted to car of differing size and wieght...thus a Metro (or 106) would not require ALL the power it is capable of producing.
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Post by 504gld on May 5, 2005 18:26:00 GMT
There is always going to be a maximum fueling setting on the pump, but just increasing fuel isn't going to give any more power. Diesels develope all torque (the pulling power) down low, where as in a petrol engine you have to rev the B****cks off it. All you'll end up with is black smoke. You could try just driving a few miles without the air cleaner intake and see if it makes any difference, although you will have to put up with the noise from the inlet manifold.
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garry
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Post by garry on May 5, 2005 23:21:46 GMT
yeh, I did try disconnecting the airbox , just made it run a bit lumpy.
I DO understand that air and fuel need to be mixed in equal quantities.
I dont have a problem in how to increase the fueling, thats why im so intested in obstructions in the intake system or....the illusive availability of a TUD turbo manifold.
as for gearing, it hits 60 with little effort, works its way to 70 and eventually makes 90.... I guess 100 could also be possible on the motorway but to be honest 90 is probably its max.
it will never keep up with a beemer or a SAAB on a twisty road as the understeer is so bad due to the wieght of the engine in the Metro shell, although the Hydragas suspension is quite impressive all the same.
Im very impressed with this TUD engine, just need more info on how to get the intake flowing better if possible. what about cams?....any other cams fit?
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Post by 504gld on May 6, 2005 10:42:31 GMT
Speed wise, the Metro/115 was the zippest but the slowest out of 106,AX,Metro because of the lower gearing. AX1.5D could top the ton. My old 106,1.4D would cruise happy on the motorway at 80-85, but struggle for more, and that was with a well run in 130k on the clock.
Maybe asking the same kind of questions in a Citroen Saxo forum if there are any will shed some light, as it had the 1.5D from day one. Its a chavver motor so I'm sure there are some mods for it that would slide under the hood of the 115 as well.
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garry
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Post by garry on May 6, 2005 11:46:41 GMT
Im 33 year old. I don't want a small go-cart to speed about in.... I do however live at the bottom of a very steep 1 mile long hill. Having been used to a 200bhp SAAB T16S for the past 2 years the Peugeot TUD Diesel is quite a drop. Although I appreciate the low down torque of the diesel believe me it nothing like the torque of the SAAB....The SAAB was rarely over 2.5K... I certainly dont want to chav it, its a metro anyway. There has to be someone somewhere at some time will appear with details about the TUD engine.....Maybe it will be me?!....I would rarther not mess on with it though until I know more about its design. |
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